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Post by iknowjack on Apr 15, 2007 19:27:13 GMT -5
Every time i attend an Anarchy show i never hear the fans discuss politics,backstage drama,other indy promotions etc etc. It makes me wonder if the entire Anarchy fan base consists only of marks. Now don't get me wrong there is nothing wrong with being a mark,and the show seems geared towards such people(and for the most part its a d**n fine show). I was just curious if they're any people in the Anarchy fan base that follows any other indys(PWG,CZW,ROH,IWA, and such).
I know that Kory Chavis and Onyx had a brief run in CZW as The Original Blackout and perhaps that turned some CZW fans onto anarchy and vice versa. Perhaps bringing in some indy talent from other companies could give anarchy some attention in the indy world as well....just a couple of random thoughts.
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Post by BB on Apr 16, 2007 7:57:25 GMT -5
NWA Anarchy does bring in outside talent and some of it's talent works for other promotions like CZW (Chavis & Onyx), ROH Jimmy Rave), FIP (Rinauro, Delay, Rave, Parham, Rockwell) etc.
In addition talent from other areas come in ocationally to often like:
AJ Styles & Abyss
Team Macktion
Texas Treats (Don Juan & Chris Marval)
Fast Eddie Vegas
Masada
And more to come.....
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Post by middlega on Apr 16, 2007 21:31:36 GMT -5
I feel pretty sure that there are some who do, and more than just me & my 9 year old son  In particular I think it's a fair bet that there's quite a few fans knowledgeable about the wrestling world outside of Cornelia sitting in the bleachers every time the doors are open, as well at least a few on the concession stand side of the building. And as BB pointed out, there's already quite a healthy contingent of "visiting talent" that's a part of Anarchy shows on a regular basis, something that is a significant part of the appeal the promotion has for me personally. That's a tradition that really goes back as far as the NWA-Georgia days in Loganville too, and I'm very glad it's continued. I think there's also a few other practical limitations to how far that sort of thing can be utilized. 1) There's only so many matches realistic on a given night. Between the current visitors, the regulars at the top & middle of the card, and the 'enhancement talent' that needs time in the ring to develop, there really isn't that much room left to add multiple bodies to the roster. 2) Financial reality almost certainly plays a role in limiting the use of outside talent. I have to think it's sometimes difficult to make things attractive to both the promotion & the worker. A lot of the top indy names today seem to be working very regionally - many of the PWG guys seem to work strictly on the west coast, ROH guys in the northeast, etc. Unfortunately, the dollars that it would take for them to justify traveling here might often be more than could be justified in terms of butts in seats. I could probably name 25 guys I'd love to see in the NWA Arena, but I also know that it wouldn't make sense for them to be there. 3) Related to the point above, I'm not at all sure how some of the best indy talent would go over in Cornelia, just because of differences in style preference and such. Without getting too specific, I'll just say that for example I don't think a "Pure Title" would be able to generate a lot of warm fuzzies in the stands. Thing is, it wouldn't set the woods on fire in most areas of the southeast either, i.e. it's not just an Anarchy thing. Every market is a little different, that happens to be one of the quirks in a lot of places in Georgia IMO. |
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Post by iknowjack on Apr 19, 2007 15:00:17 GMT -5
I was by no means trying to bash any of the talent that comes in or performs on a regular basis at Anarchy. I was trying to get a conversation like this going though because Georgia use to have such an amazing wrestling scene and it seems pretty dry these days....southern wrestling all together seems to not evolved much since the 80s.
Guys like Chavis,Rave,Rinauro,and recently Parham are consistently gold and will have me coming to Anarchy shows every chance i get....but then they are followed by a guy in a leatherface mask. Stuff like that and the Hollywood Brunettes really turn me off as a fan and is almost an insult.
IWA:Deep South seems to have a decent mix of talent and southern charm. The May 5th show has several matches that include Anarchy stars. Rinauro Vs Quackenbush, The Devils Rejects VS Drake Younger and Eddie Kingston, Jigsaw VS Jimmy Rave. If any of those matches were to take place in an Anarchy ring i would quit my job,sell my kidney and do whatever it takes to be there.
I know its unreasonable to ask for alot of top indy talent,but if there is one person who would have reasoning to be there no matter how brief,and could easily draw fans such as myself it would be Bryan Danielson.
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Post by SusiQ on Apr 19, 2007 15:52:18 GMT -5
Are you a transplanted Southerner? I'm not trying to be insulting or anything, but from your taste in wrestling, it seems that you are not from the south, originally.
Sure, it'd be great to have "top indy names" in Anarchy, but..
1) Alot of "top indy" guys just would not be well received in the Anarchy arena. The "top indies" are typically the indies from the northeast or Florida, where the wrestling style is different. ROH matches to me, a long time Wildside/Anarchy fan, are boring, and most of the time, seemingly pointless. And occasionally, we get a match in the arena from wrestlers who have been to ROH on multiple occasions (ex: Sal) that is seemingly pointless, or at least, parts of the match. While the flashy moves may grab attention, there is no reason for it, and are, for the most part, over done to the point of us "marks" being immune and untouched by these extravagant moves.
2) To us "marks" who "dont know anything except Anarchy".. Anarchy guys ARE top indy guys. Week in and week out, we are exposed to these guys and watch them grow into superior athletes. Some, like Parham, continue to stick around and be top talent, while others, like Rave, branch out and test the waters of other promotions, sometimes only occasionally coming back (AJ Styles).
In my honest, humble opinion, NWA Anarchy is THE Top Indy. Its where I believe wrestlers should strive to get to before making another step up into the big leagues. Thats not how it is, due to the fact that NWA Anarchy seats such a small crowd, is located in such a small town, and isnt very well known outside of this region. But, I think it SHOULD be the top place to work. We have excellent talent, and a fairly strong internet following (including fans from countries such as Australia and Germany, as well as Japan, Ireland, and the UK).
Sure we arent "flashy," sure we, as southern wrestling, "havnt evolved" since the 80's... but obviously, thats how we like it. If it aint broke, dont fix it, right?
P.S. I use "we" as in the Fans/Workers/Staff/Etc. Anarchy as a whole. Its small and we like it. I know probably 90+% of the crowd other than the people I sit with every show. Its a family, even if we arent so fond of some of the cousins or whatever.
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Post by Guest on Apr 19, 2007 15:56:59 GMT -5
Yes, mr. expert.... please tell us how indy-tastic "WORKRATE" OMFG!!!! = being a successful wrestling promotion. If you're insulted as a fan, go watch TNA... I promise they'll insult you a whole lot more.
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Post by iknowjack on Apr 19, 2007 18:47:36 GMT -5
OK,someone must have missed something here as i am not trying to insult Anarchy. I believe its a good show,but it has a long way to go before its in top indy contention. My first post was simply curiosity about the fan base as i don't get out to see Anarchy as much as i would like too. There is no doubt that Anarchy caters to the southern fan,its a slower style with more emphasis on characters than work rate. I think to be a top Indy it needs to find a balance between pleasing the smarts and the marks. Its heading in the right direction the guys i mentioned earlier are consistently in good matches and seem to be over with the crowd. I think Kory Chavis will go on to be one of the top indy talents,and Tank is one of the best hardcore guys out there right now. There is also alot of bad moments though. For example,i was at Hardcore Hell this year. All was well until the dominous,abomination face off. That was shockmaster level wrestlecrap...
as for TNA...dont worry i stoped watching that along time ago.
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Post by Guest on Apr 19, 2007 19:04:42 GMT -5
Two 7 ft. Tall , 400 lbs men hitting each other as hard as humanly possible was as bad Tugboat with a glittery stormtrooper helmet falling on his ass?
I mean granted they weren't near naked stick boys trading crisply executed armbars for !!HONOR!! but by the looks of things my definition of good wrestling and your definition of good wrestling will never, ever be close to the same so that arguement could probably go on for hours.
You may not be trying to insult the promotion, but you're being awful condescending with your "praise".
This is pro wrestling. It's supposed to be ridiculous.
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Post by SusiQ on Apr 19, 2007 21:34:33 GMT -5
And, whats so insulting about the Hollywood Brunettes?
The fact that they're smallish guys who look like they SHOULD be indy-tastic... but have enough talent to not have to be?
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Post by middlega on Apr 20, 2007 8:34:36 GMT -5
My first post was simply curiosity about the fan base as i don't get out to see Anarchy as much as i would like too. ... I think to be a top Indy it needs to find a balance between pleasing the smarts and the marks. Okay, let me try a different answer to your first post then, as I think it might lend itself to addressing the second sentence I quoted. Off hand, I'd say the mix is probably something on the order of 90% traditional Southern wrestling marks. Some nights that might be high, other nights it's probably low. When I answered originally I didn't really address the percentages, I was just speaking to the existence of anyone in the crowd who followed the other indies at all. On a good night, I would guess there's probably 30 people in the building who have ever seen five minutes of Danielson, less than that of Delerious, and maybe 10 people who aren't in the business in some way who have ever heard of El Generico. Given that mix, I'd say Anarchy hits the worker & match makeup pretty close to the balance that you referred to. They have to work with the audience that's available to them, and I know they do try to put together shows that have something for fans of all styles. But realistically they have to put butts in seats in order to do the shows at all, and the regional preferences are always going to have to be acknowledged. Personally, I prefer the ROH style to anything else going right now, or maybe a mix of ROH & PWG. Assuming an appropriate undercard, I'd readily pay $50 a ticket to see a Danielson-McGuinness main event as a one-off, but I'd certainly have a great view since I'd be in a nearly empty building. Try to present a card heavy in that style on a regular basis in virtually any part of the South and you're almost certainly looking at crowds of less than 50 a night, and the math for that just doesn't add up. All that said, knowing the reality, I still find things that bring me to Anarchy. I'm old enough & Southern enough to be able to find delight in watching "The Stray Cat" work his old-school magic, to watching Parham further develop into a very strong heel, to watching Vain be an underrated heel himself, to seeing Hayden turn it up several notches, to watching Bailey be Bailey. Heck, I enjoy watching the booking unfold, occasionally trying to guess ahead with the bookers, and even trying to figure out why something worked (or occasionally didn't). I know I don't watch for the same reasons as most of the fans in the building, I know I think too much about the art of the business or whatnot and probably don't mark out nearly enough ... or at least not in the traditional way. And yet I find myself "marking" over the things I enjoy, smartmark- internet wrestling elitist geek though I might be in a lot of ways. Ultimately it comes down to being entertained, and there's quite a bit about Anarchy that accomplishes that for me even though it may not always be in the most obvious ways. Maybe that's just what happens when a 40 year old raised on Gordon Solie & Wrestling II appreciates the national indy scene a lot and figures out how to blend all of it together for their own enjoyment. |
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Post by SusiQ on Apr 22, 2007 16:27:15 GMT -5
Actually, alot of people here have seen Delirious.
In case you dont remember, Delirious, Daizee Haze and Matt Sydal all worked in the NWA Arena pretty regularly during Wildside, and were pretty over with the crowd.
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Post by middlega on Apr 23, 2007 0:55:44 GMT -5
In case you dont remember, Delirious, Daizee Haze and Matt Sydal all worked in the NWA Arena pretty regularly during Wildside, and were pretty over with the crowd. Although I did sort of pick his name at random just trying for someone to be representative of a certain level, the truth is that I remember Haze & Sydal being semi-regular but had forgotten about Delirious appearing in Wildside until you mentioned it. One of the hazards of old age I guess. |
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Post by Sweet Daddy Bugg on Apr 23, 2007 11:19:00 GMT -5
To the person who started this topic, trust me, you are not the only one who is privy to the top indies in America. I'm probably the biggest Ring Of Honor fan in the state of Georgia. I also follow promotions like IWA Mid-South, PWG, Jersey All-Pro, CZW before it became pathetic, NWA Central States, NOAH, Dragon Gate, and Savannah's own World-1. Yes, I'm transplanted (I'm from Kansas City), but that shouldn't matter.
From what I've seen, there seems to be a majority of fans that are unwilling to think outside the box and expand their horizons as far as tastes in wrestling are concerned. It seems that anything not WWE or Georgia is out of their comfort zone. I believe that, if booked properly and given a legitamite chance, a match between KENTA and Davey Richards would gain interest and tear the house down in big-city Georgia just as well as it did in New Jersey.
I am a card-carrying member of the smart mark community, or the IWC if you will (not to be confused with the excellent Pitt-area promotion), but past the obnoxious ways of the stereotypical smark.
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Post by BB on Apr 23, 2007 11:42:13 GMT -5
Davey Richards appeared in Anarchy not too long ago in match against a masked Tony Kozina, who trained him.
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Post by SweetDaddyBugg on Apr 23, 2007 17:48:11 GMT -5
Yeah? How was that match?
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In particular I think it's a fair bet that there's quite a few fans knowledgeable about the wrestling world outside of Cornelia sitting in the bleachers every time the doors are open, as well at least a few on the concession stand side of the building.
